Remember this grown ups. When on sudafed check your head, when on beer make sure your gear is near.

Climbers what a bunch of misfits we were… now sport bars and rightous people we are.

Remember climb safe and do it in the style you like and find like minded to climb with you. Don’t be a dumb ass and kill yourself because you smoked to many cigs and had a heart attack or drank to many energy drinks and you had your prostate expand and you could not lead that last pitch and had to spoon because you only have sport drinks and sport bars for food and water.

Smoke a J and drink some water and bring your head lamp and a guide book I have heard that some people forgot all of the above and had to spoon all nite long thirsty.

I do not for the record smoke pot but I do climb with several who do and they are doing good and might just make it to be a judge or a president or something?? Maybe a Olympic swimmer who knows.

harihari wrote:Trad–

The idea that drugs reveal the real you is absurd. First– as any modern neuroscientist or philosopher (or Buddhist for that matter) will tell you– there is no you (at least not one that we can locate). Consciousness, as Torre Norstranders calls it, is the user illusion and the you is a kind of provisional set-up that allows consciousness’ various systems to interact. Daniel Dennett calls it the multiple drafts model.

Second, it’s not clear that even if there *were* a real you that is in you somewhere, it’s not clear that drugs reveal it (and you realise how all of this language is metaphorical, right?…if there is one thing Julian Jaynes is good for, it’s making us understand that w can’t talk about ANYTHING without metaphors). OK, antidepressants make you less scared…but fear is a normal limbic response to danger; it is as real as no fear. OK, beer makes your animal instincts come out, but it’s not clear that these are any more authentically you than the social self we have in normal life that balances everything; it’s just that one part of you is disabled and another enabled.

Harihari, What you just wrote is well cool and all but that is one perspective OK. Now I could use several ancient tribes who completley disagree. Now we can also use some more modern tribes as in science and studies on fear and drugs and you are wrong! Fear is not felt by all some never have that sense. Others love the feel of an emotion in very grave places but is that fear??? They would argue NO. And adavan is not an anti depresent. And why do you feel that antis would stop fear??? Would it not make fear more active in the mind???

No matter what you say you could not control your behavior on pot and you lost all sense of perspective and could not place gear or even climb. You or your buddies also forgot all sense and climbed without water or food or the ability to realize what time it was. That is the same way a person behaves in a fire ( who cannot handle a non controlled life) they lose all sense of perspective and stand there and burn and then in a panic state they pile into a door way unable to get past all the others who are like minded.

Peace

pppppppssssfffffssssttt….. heeeerrree is the bong mang..

TRAD– Behaviour on pot while was far from uncontrollable.  More like supremely forgetful– overfocus on one thing means not focusing on another.  Oooh wow, man, this crick is sooo coool…uhhh dude where’s my belay device? type of thing.  Also lack of food or water had nothign to do with– had just eaten a nice lunch.

Ativan is not an antidepressant, you are correct; it’s a benzodiazepene (anti anxiety) cousin to sleeping pills etc etc and a distant relative of Valium.  Antidepressants *do* change the way many people feel fear; this is fact ( a cursory search of epocrates will show you this).  One reason they work on depression and sometimes anxiety is they kill the fear feedback loop.  I wanted to hear from people who had used antidepressants while climbing to see how the experience changed etc etc.

I would really liek to hear about this tribe you mention whose members allegedly do not feel fear…can you passa link on? 
to get past all the others who are like minded.

harihari wrote:trad– sorry, I am having trouble understanding your writing.

Really is that the best response you can have. Excellent. The mass will get on your side soon. You read what you wrote you tit. Oh I see Sark has not read anything but responded again. I think the text comment was about your writing but Sark is well you know.